Home | I wouldn't buy it | Quiznos gets toasted with lawsuit

Quiznos gets toasted with lawsuit

It looks like the Quiznos franchisees are not standing by in the face of apparent fraud:

The primary allegations of the complaint are that the franchisees were harmed by the company’s "deceptive recruitment practices" and "failure to deal in good faith" when it took franchise fees from the plaintiffs, but refused to approve locations to open Quizno’s stores. In addition, the complaint charged, Quizno’s has refused to return any portion of the franchise fees, even though the plaintiffs paid more than 18 months ago and are now being threatened with termination.

and more general comments…

Commenting on the lawsuit, Susan P. Kezios, President of the American Franchisee Association, said, "This lawsuit is a classic example of a popular franchise chain using its brand name recognition to deceive hard-working Americans into investing their dollars to grow a franchise. Bob-the talking baby in Quizno’s current media campaign-is definitely talking out of both sides of his mouth in this case."

Added Klein: "It is unfortunate that not enough people are aware of the abuse that franchisees often endure at the hand of their franchisors. Too many entrepreneurs automatically assume that buying a franchise is a safe investment. We are confident that we will prevail in our lawsuit, and are eager to finally bring justice to the franchisees who were victimized while also alerting people who are interested in purchasing a Quizno’s franchise to make an educated decision.

I don’t have a comment from Quiznos, but I’d assume they deny the allegations. Still, Quiznos claims to open a new franchise every 16 hours. Have those franchisees all done enough due diligence to uncover these allegations of fraud? I fear they are too eager to hand over the $25,000 franchise fee.

Even if this lawsuit turns out to represents a relatively small percentage of franchisees, I would never buy a franchise from a company who would keep an entire franchise fee after refusing to timely approve site selection. Perhaps Quiznos has a logical explanation, but I find it hard to believe so many franchisees in the same city would have the identical claims of fraud. Our legal system allows freedom to contract even if the terms are unfair, but those contracts are not enforceable if one can prove fraud or unconscionable terms.

So what is the problem?

  • management’s ego and greed
  • salesmen training and guidelines
  • commission/bonus structure

The salemen’s compensation is composed of mostly commission and bonuses on total franchise fees. There is virtually no regard for franchisee’s site selection wished or oversaturating the geographic market. Management is certainly aware of the complications, but do nothing so long as the franchise fees keep rolling in. These circumstances seem obvious to me. What do you think?

About Ryan Knoll

Attorney and advisor with an interest in franchising. Feel free to email me comments and questions on the "Contact Us" page.
96 comments
Barb
Barb

[quote comment="123105"][quote comment="123070"]I purchased a franchise 2 years ago and had a site approved for my Quiznos store. I purchased the land at $125,000 and began the process of planning the building. After I had spent a lot of time planning, I was about to get started when I learned of the massive lawsuit. After much research, I have come to the conclusion that I need to run as fast as I can from Quiznos. The only problem is I have over $150,000 invested so far. While I can sell the land for a profit, my question is... Can I sell the Frnachise to a buyeer? or Can I sue Quiznos and have any success? PLEASE HELP ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks in advance[/quote] If you can find something in the UFOC that wasn't disclosed, such as lawsuits or some risk that was known by Quiznos and would have been material to you making a decision, you can probably rescind the Franchise Agreement with the help of a lawyer and get your Franchise Fee back. You can probably sell the franchise, and may find some welcoming buyers because you already have a site selected an approved with much of the pre-planning already done. But, you will have to look at the Franchise Agreement to see if there is a tranfer restriction if you have not yet opened for business.[/quote] This is the problem. The one sided UFOC. Hopefully judges in our country will see how unethical this is. I am hoping more judges will see the injustice of these contracts as a disgrace to our country. Allowing people to give up their rights and everything is in favor of the franchisor. This should not be allowed in the greatest country in the world. It gives the franchisor the right to screw over the hard working people of our country. (By misrepresentations, lies and fraud. ) People need to seek the advice of a competant franchise lawyer that can verify the lies before you sign a franchise agreement. Until you the franchisee grasp the reality that there is evil people out there like Quinos's corporation and you don't seek counsel and understand what due diligence entails you will fall into being a victim of what I a call one of the biggest crimes of our time. You have to be 110% sure the corporation you are commiting to is good and honestly wants you to succeed. I know because my husband and I did the same thing. We did have a lawyer read the UFOC. Which I have contacted them to disclose how unhappy I am that they said everything was okay. Was it okay? No. So you have to do you due diligence on the lawyer also. Many don't even know what a franchise lawyer is. Many you can pay to do killer due diligence for you. All this has to be done before you sign any agreement. What do you expect from a evil franchisor to disclose their real agenda to you. Of course they wouldn't. We would of never signed such an evil one sided contract. But like most of us who don't have the knowlege of the franchise world wouldn't think like them. After all we are not crooks and most of us wouldn't want to hurt anyone. I wouldn't. I couldn't live with myself. Understand the mind of the franchisor before you sign. And I promise you, you will be saved from financial hell.

Some advice
Some advice

[quote comment="123070"]I purchased a franchise 2 years ago and had a site approved for my Quiznos store. I purchased the land at $125,000 and began the process of planning the building. After I had spent a lot of time planning, I was about to get started when I learned of the massive lawsuit. After much research, I have come to the conclusion that I need to run as fast as I can from Quiznos. The only problem is I have over $150,000 invested so far. While I can sell the land for a profit, my question is... Can I sell the Frnachise to a buyeer? or Can I sue Quiznos and have any success? PLEASE HELP ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks in advance[/quote] If you can find something in the UFOC that wasn't disclosed, such as lawsuits or some risk that was known by Quiznos and would have been material to you making a decision, you can probably rescind the Franchise Agreement with the help of a lawyer and get your Franchise Fee back. You can probably sell the franchise, and may find some welcoming buyers because you already have a site selected an approved with much of the pre-planning already done. But, you will have to look at the Franchise Agreement to see if there is a tranfer restriction if you have not yet opened for business.

I have a question
I have a question

I purchased a franchise 2 years ago and had a site approved for my Quiznos store. I purchased the land at $125,000 and began the process of planning the building. After I had spent a lot of time planning, I was about to get started when I learned of the massive lawsuit. After much research, I have come to the conclusion that I need to run as fast as I can from Quiznos. The only problem is I have over $150,000 invested so far. While I can sell the land for a profit, my question is... Can I sell the Frnachise to a buyeer? or Can I sue Quiznos and have any success? PLEASE HELP ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks in advance

Barb
Barb

[quote comment="120305"]Prospective Quiznos buyers please read this carefully. I have always prided myself in that fact that I try to make good decisions. Yet, the decision of my husband and myself to purchase a Quizno's restaurant is one decision that has been anything but positive. Please take your time reading my story because it may help you to avoid making a terrible mistake. I am hoping that by sharing my experience the information may save your family, finances, sanity and your future. We transfered our Quiznos over 23 months ago. Our weekly labor ranges between 22% to 25% - the goal is 20%. Average food costs range between 30% to 33% the goal is 30%. Not only have we not made money, but we have lost over $45,000 in the last twelve months in addition to $34,000 during the first 11 months. Additionally, another Quiznos near my location is also showing similar dollar losses based upon information that the owner has shared. I realize that there are poor stores in the system. It is unrealistic to assume that every owner runs a great operation. However, our store has one of the highest customer approval ratings in the area. Despite working as a "volunteer" at our location for the past 22 months I have never sacrificed quality or service. We have never skimped on labor in order to squeeze more money out of the bottom line. Our store is meticulously clean and the employees are well trained. Yet, despite all of our efforts, we have lost a lot of money. Yes, we conduct local marketing weekly in addition to other strategies that the company suggests to increase revenue - but to no avail. It is fortunate for Freddy B that he is doing so well, however, he is the very rare exception. I too have a friend that is profitable. Her location is in a busy commercial district with plenty of daytime professional traffic in addition to evening residents as well. Despite the fact that her store is one of the more frequented locations, she remarked that because her business is one of the highest grossing stores in the region, she is frankly surprised that she is not making a greater profit. She, like I, works her business diligently both in front and behind the scenes. She is also one of the fortunate few. In our case, the fact that the company put not one - but three - new Quiznos extremely close to our existing store has been but one of several factors for our lack of profit. Even our customers remark that they are surprised that the company places stores in such close proximity. Our restaurant, once grossed between $9,000 to $11,000 average per week before we bought it. The addition of the other stores dramatically cut into our customer base. Currently, a $9,000 week is the rare exception. After paying over $320,000 for this store, we expected to at least net $70,000 per year. We would settle for breaking even at this point. We still have customers that make the extra trip to patronize our store because we offer the best service and most pleasant environment of the other Quiznos in the immediate vicinity. Yet, that is not enough to help our bottom line. We realized that we were not going to make money two months into our venture. We put our store on the market right away. Today, almost two years later, we have been forced due to financial constraints to give it away. Another owner has offered us $90,000 and we are finally getting out. He knows that he will make a profit because at $90,000 it is a positive net sum gain for him. A store can not even be constructed for $90,000. He has said that based upon our P&L and the price that he is paying, he will probably make about $30,000 - perhaps $35,000 per year at our location. The key to profitability according to our buyer, is owning several that were purchased for very little and planning to make about $30 - $50K per location based upon the traffic flow of each individual store. The key is to pay a low as possible for a store in order to squeeze out a profit from each location. One might ask why do so many franchisses fail to make a profit and so few do? The answers are: 1) The profitable stores are located in areas with significant traffic flow to offset the high costs associated with operating one of these stores. 2) Non profitable stores (poor operations excluded) have been canabalized by our very own franchisor. It is apparent that none of the company's decision makers understand the franchisor's own required reading of "Behind the Golden Arches, The Ray Croc Story". If they understood the symbiotic relationship that exists between corporate and its franchisees, then they would realize that the franchisee is the life blood of the company and it is not in anyone's best interest to undermine the very people that make the system operate. 3) A store's location is not sufficient to produce the high traffic necessary to cover its numerous expenses. 4) In regard to expenses, the franchisor has a monopoly upon most services, food and equipment necessary for us to operate. There are simply too many hands in the till for profit to filter down to the bottom line - the franchisee. There is something very wrong when a person can go to their local Restaurant Depot and find the same exact product made by the same manufacturer, same weight and ingredients but pay half the price of the same item sold by our required distributor. Many of my fellow owners have found this to be true regarding food and equipment time and time again. Other franchises that have a "franchisee consortium" responsible for monitoring and regulating costs of the goods and services utilized by franchisees have not only a higher satisfaction rate but are profitable as well. - (Source QSR magazine.) Of course there are always problems even in the best of systems, yet the bottom line is profitability. No one buys a business because they "like" the product. Investors purchase businesses in order to make money. In addition, there is no transparency within the company despite the fact that our franchisee's pay extremely high royalties. Where there are royalties there should be total transparency. These restaurants are a long shot in the very best case. Yes, there are those who will sing the praises of the franchisor, but the extreme and vast majority will say that it is simply not worth the time or investment. 5) The existing business model is fatally flawed and exists for the sole purpose of making money for corporate as well as their investors. 6) Many of us have paid too much for our stores. 7) The costs keep creeping back up from the reductions announced by last year's new administration while the suggested retail prices have either fallen or remained the same. Our broker has decided not to sell any future Quiznos until the company changes its entire business model. Ours will be the last that he will handle until the tide truly turns. It has been predicted by the new administration that the future for Quiznos is "bright" and that eventually there will be more "positive" stories rather than negative ones such as ours. It is a known fact that there are at least 450 Quiznos for sale on a well known web based real estate site versus only 24 Subways. Why do you think that is the case? Stories just like ours have played out and are occurring every day. Of course, Subway has its share of difficulties as well, but one thing is undeniable, a Subway does not stay on the market very long before it sells, whereas it is almost impossible to sell a Quiznos - let alone give them away as lease assumption only. Someone must be making something worthwhile at our competitor's stores otherwise they would not be in such high demand. It is widely viewed that the "happy" owners of the future will be the ones that are either the second or third generation franchisees. When those of us who have over paid and are not able to financially continue on at our Quizno's "volunteer" jobs have either had enough and sold for pennies on the dollar or "gone dark" the next generation - the future "happy" ones - will take over what we have built with our blood, sweat, tears and cold hard cash. So yes, the company is accurate on one point: There will eventually be many more positive stories about which the company will boast. Those stories will come from the new owners who have purchased the deal of a lifetime and will ultimately profit from our failed investments. At the price that most of us are either walking away from or giving them away for in order to extricate ourselves from this financial nightmare called Quiznos, the next owners will actually be able to make a living from one of these stores. It is called "churning" and I firmly believe that this is an integral strategy to the corporation's plan to make their restaurant a worthwhile investment in the future. It is simply a matter of time before we all cry "uncle" and corporate knows it. And yes, then the next generation will truly be "happy". Please think carefully before you invest in ANY business. Perform due diligence, talk to other owners, read comments posted on the internet, read trade magazines - anything that will help you to make an informed and objective decision. I only wish that we had known about this web site as well as the many others that I have since found in our familie's nightmare odessy. Perhaps things would be different and life would actually be "normal". This was a very costly lesson I hope that you can learn from our mistake.[/quote] I believe the Scadens are working on being the most hated people in the franchise world.

Barb
Barb

[quote comment="73090"]I know how you can get out of it. A bullet to the head.[/quote] I believe it is the wrong target.

Barb
Barb

[quote comment="93267"][quote comment="190"]Has anyone else in Florida been screwed like the rest of us? If so...what did you do? I have a lot of money tied up (as we all seem to have)and have had no follow up! I am 16 months into this and still have no building...I have quit my job based on the BS timeline given to me and nothing! Who do we contact about this? Does anyone from the corp office even give a damn? What about the Pres/Founder? Is there some sort of support group for franchisees? Help![/quote] do not even open the it does not make any money do u know that 34 quiznos opened in new york in 2006 there are only 11 left a year later so do your home work i own store #3601 and i am tired of working for $0.00 3 years ago moved to tampa i would cut my losses now i have lost over $300K cash do not have a loan did over $400K in sales and still it does not work there are no profit in it.[/quote] Listen please listen to this. Be saved from financial hell. Get your job back. Do you not see all these consistant stories. Consistancy is proof the stories are true. Run do not walk away from this. They do not care about you they just want your money. And they have more money than anyone of us could even dream of having. Their lust for money will never be satisfied. So keep your money in your pocket not theirs!!

Barb
Barb

[quote comment="111425"]Quiznoz sucks. They are a losing franchise and it is finally getting out there what they are doing to these people that are just trying to make an honest living from a cheating, deceiving, lying company with Rick Schaden the owner. If I were any Quiznos, all of you together should cut them off of their royalties, start using your own vendors, and tell them all to go to hell. Lets face it if they are getting any kick backs they are not going to make any money. If every single franchise owner did it, maybe their corporate office will close. RIck Schaden has made alot of money off you people and will continue to screw you unless you cut him off. Their attitude is their pockets are deep, so they dont care about any of you. If you are not far from closing, at least you can get some gratitude out of it plus a little money back by cutting them off. FYI Rick Schaden had already moved on to another franchise 123 fit, 30 minute circuit training. In less than 2 years over 30 clubs have closed. None of the franchises are doing good at all and will probably end up failing. Once Rick Schaden seen this, he had his name removed from the UFOC and has disappeared. He is now openning another place called "Smash Burger" Stay away from anything that is tied to Rick Scaden.[/quote] Amen to this! They are plain evil. Get the word out to everyone you know.

Barb
Barb

[quote comment="117868"]I am suprised by all these negative comments. I have opened 2 Quizno's locations and am anxiously awaiting the opening of my third unit. Each unit is netting over $70k per year. The Quizno's AD and I have built a great working relationship. You can not expect these things to open up and and be magic profit generators. But if you work the system, market your product, pay attention to your business, the Quizno's model will generate a profitable business for you....[/quote] Is your Q a first, second generation franchise? Where is your location? How much was your build out? You may be the second success story I've heard. Just maybe you are in with corporate. There is so many factors to consider. All you have to do is verify what you say and then we will believe you. If you are successful I am happy for you. If you are misleading us than shame on you. How many people need to be hurt? If you are successful there has to be other explanations for your success.

Barb
Barb

[quote comment="451"]I agree 100% with above comments, my life has been ruined owning a Quiznos store. This was my life's worst mistake, I am stupid idiot who fell into sales persons trap. Their graphs are inflated full of lies can't be trusted. Better work for minimum wage instead of owning a headache and make your life miserable.[/quote] You are not a stupid idiot. Like Bob Barber's suicide note says, "My wife is not a fool, I am not a fool. But we have been fooled." Quiznos has the worst reputation in the franchise world as people who have unethical business practices. Don't blame yourself. If you know they misrepresented you. Whose fault is it? All they can throw at us is due diligence and their one sided UFOC. It is unconscionable. Not fair and gives them a right to disclose false material facts. I have to admit before I bought a Schaden zee, (not a Q) I have educated myself in how their concepts work in the business world. I don't care what they say their business ethics are a disgrace to our country. Hurting the hard working people of America to feed their lust for power and money at our expense. Shame on you Quisnos!

A costly lesson
A costly lesson

Prospective Quiznos buyers please read this carefully. I have always prided myself in that fact that I try to make good decisions. Yet, the decision of my husband and myself to purchase a Quizno's restaurant is one decision that has been anything but positive. Please take your time reading my story because it may help you to avoid making a terrible mistake. I am hoping that by sharing my experience the information may save your family, finances, sanity and your future. We transfered our Quiznos over 23 months ago. Our weekly labor ranges between 22% to 25% - the goal is 20%. Average food costs range between 30% to 33% the goal is 30%. Not only have we not made money, but we have lost over $45,000 in the last twelve months in addition to $34,000 during the first 11 months. Additionally, another Quiznos near my location is also showing similar dollar losses based upon information that the owner has shared. I realize that there are poor stores in the system. It is unrealistic to assume that every owner runs a great operation. However, our store has one of the highest customer approval ratings in the area. Despite working as a "volunteer" at our location for the past 22 months I have never sacrificed quality or service. We have never skimped on labor in order to squeeze more money out of the bottom line. Our store is meticulously clean and the employees are well trained. Yet, despite all of our efforts, we have lost a lot of money. Yes, we conduct local marketing weekly in addition to other strategies that the company suggests to increase revenue - but to no avail. It is fortunate for Freddy B that he is doing so well, however, he is the very rare exception. I too have a friend that is profitable. Her location is in a busy commercial district with plenty of daytime professional traffic in addition to evening residents as well. Despite the fact that her store is one of the more frequented locations, she remarked that because her business is one of the highest grossing stores in the region, she is frankly surprised that she is not making a greater profit. She, like I, works her business diligently both in front and behind the scenes. She is also one of the fortunate few. In our case, the fact that the company put not one - but three - new Quiznos extremely close to our existing store has been but one of several factors for our lack of profit. Even our customers remark that they are surprised that the company places stores in such close proximity. Our restaurant, once grossed between $9,000 to $11,000 average per week before we bought it. The addition of the other stores dramatically cut into our customer base. Currently, a $9,000 week is the rare exception. After paying over $320,000 for this store, we expected to at least net $70,000 per year. We would settle for breaking even at this point. We still have customers that make the extra trip to patronize our store because we offer the best service and most pleasant environment of the other Quiznos in the immediate vicinity. Yet, that is not enough to help our bottom line. We realized that we were not going to make money two months into our venture. We put our store on the market right away. Today, almost two years later, we have been forced due to financial constraints to give it away. Another owner has offered us $90,000 and we are finally getting out. He knows that he will make a profit because at $90,000 it is a positive net sum gain for him. A store can not even be constructed for $90,000. He has said that based upon our P&L and the price that he is paying, he will probably make about $30,000 - perhaps $35,000 per year at our location. The key to profitability according to our buyer, is owning several that were purchased for very little and planning to make about $30 - $50K per location based upon the traffic flow of each individual store. The key is to pay a low as possible for a store in order to squeeze out a profit from each location. One might ask why do so many franchisses fail to make a profit and so few do? The answers are: 1) The profitable stores are located in areas with significant traffic flow to offset the high costs associated with operating one of these stores. 2) Non profitable stores (poor operations excluded) have been canabalized by our very own franchisor. It is apparent that none of the company's decision makers understand the franchisor's own required reading of "Behind the Golden Arches, The Ray Croc Story". If they understood the symbiotic relationship that exists between corporate and its franchisees, then they would realize that the franchisee is the life blood of the company and it is not in anyone's best interest to undermine the very people that make the system operate. 3) A store's location is not sufficient to produce the high traffic necessary to cover its numerous expenses. 4) In regard to expenses, the franchisor has a monopoly upon most services, food and equipment necessary for us to operate. There are simply too many hands in the till for profit to filter down to the bottom line - the franchisee. There is something very wrong when a person can go to their local Restaurant Depot and find the same exact product made by the same manufacturer, same weight and ingredients but pay half the price of the same item sold by our required distributor. Many of my fellow owners have found this to be true regarding food and equipment time and time again. Other franchises that have a "franchisee consortium" responsible for monitoring and regulating costs of the goods and services utilized by franchisees have not only a higher satisfaction rate but are profitable as well. - (Source QSR magazine.) Of course there are always problems even in the best of systems, yet the bottom line is profitability. No one buys a business because they "like" the product. Investors purchase businesses in order to make money. In addition, there is no transparency within the company despite the fact that our franchisee's pay extremely high royalties. Where there are royalties there should be total transparency. These restaurants are a long shot in the very best case. Yes, there are those who will sing the praises of the franchisor, but the extreme and vast majority will say that it is simply not worth the time or investment. 5) The existing business model is fatally flawed and exists for the sole purpose of making money for corporate as well as their investors. 6) Many of us have paid too much for our stores. 7) The costs keep creeping back up from the reductions announced by last year's new administration while the suggested retail prices have either fallen or remained the same. Our broker has decided not to sell any future Quiznos until the company changes its entire business model. Ours will be the last that he will handle until the tide truly turns. It has been predicted by the new administration that the future for Quiznos is "bright" and that eventually there will be more "positive" stories rather than negative ones such as ours. It is a known fact that there are at least 450 Quiznos for sale on a well known web based real estate site versus only 24 Subways. Why do you think that is the case? Stories just like ours have played out and are occurring every day. Of course, Subway has its share of difficulties as well, but one thing is undeniable, a Subway does not stay on the market very long before it sells, whereas it is almost impossible to sell a Quiznos - let alone give them away as lease assumption only. Someone must be making something worthwhile at our competitor's stores otherwise they would not be in such high demand. It is widely viewed that the "happy" owners of the future will be the ones that are either the second or third generation franchisees. When those of us who have over paid and are not able to financially continue on at our Quizno's "volunteer" jobs have either had enough and sold for pennies on the dollar or "gone dark" the next generation - the future "happy" ones - will take over what we have built with our blood, sweat, tears and cold hard cash. So yes, the company is accurate on one point: There will eventually be many more positive stories about which the company will boast. Those stories will come from the new owners who have purchased the deal of a lifetime and will ultimately profit from our failed investments. At the price that most of us are either walking away from or giving them away for in order to extricate ourselves from this financial nightmare called Quiznos, the next owners will actually be able to make a living from one of these stores. It is called "churning" and I firmly believe that this is an integral strategy to the corporation's plan to make their restaurant a worthwhile investment in the future. It is simply a matter of time before we all cry "uncle" and corporate knows it. And yes, then the next generation will truly be "happy". Please think carefully before you invest in ANY business. Perform due diligence, talk to other owners, read comments posted on the internet, read trade magazines - anything that will help you to make an informed and objective decision. I only wish that we had known about this web site as well as the many others that I have since found in our familie's nightmare odessy. Perhaps things would be different and life would actually be "normal". This was a very costly lesson I hope that you can learn from our mistake.

Freddy B
Freddy B

I am suprised by all these negative comments. I have opened 2 Quizno's locations and am anxiously awaiting the opening of my third unit. Each unit is netting over $70k per year. The Quizno's AD and I have built a great working relationship. You can not expect these things to open up and and be magic profit generators. But if you work the system, market your product, pay attention to your business, the Quizno's model will generate a profitable business for you....

KIm
KIm

I was wondering why the Quiznos in Montgomery Alabama were all closing. I see why. I think one is open . The food was pretty good. However several have close in the city. They all closed after only a short time open.

Bob
Bob

Quiznoz sucks. They are a losing franchise and it is finally getting out there what they are doing to these people that are just trying to make an honest living from a cheating, deceiving, lying company with Rick Schaden the owner. If I were any Quiznos, all of you together should cut them off of their royalties, start using your own vendors, and tell them all to go to hell. Lets face it if they are getting any kick backs they are not going to make any money. If every single franchise owner did it, maybe their corporate office will close. RIck Schaden has made alot of money off you people and will continue to screw you unless you cut him off. Their attitude is their pockets are deep, so they dont care about any of you. If you are not far from closing, at least you can get some gratitude out of it plus a little money back by cutting them off. FYI Rick Schaden had already moved on to another franchise 123 fit, 30 minute circuit training. In less than 2 years over 30 clubs have closed. None of the franchises are doing good at all and will probably end up failing. Once Rick Schaden seen this, he had his name removed from the UFOC and has disappeared. He is now openning another place called "Smash Burger" Stay away from anything that is tied to Rick Scaden.

Barb
Barb

The more Icomment="62136"]could somebody help!!! store sold to buyer and buyer not certified over one year.i am certified managing owner with 25% share only on paper.new buyer defaulted , franchise agreement terminated. quiznos suing me for lost royalties for term of 15 years. any advice? please help.Any laws to protect against this suit.[/quote] i HAVE READ ENOUGH ABOUT QUIZNOS TO KNOW IT IS PLAIN EVIL. sO MANY PEOPLE HURT I DO NOT UNDERSTAND PEOPLE WHO ARE SO WEALTHY TO GO OUT AND STEAL AND RUIN PEOPLE'S Lives. They are not stopping with sandwiches. 123 fit, and Smash Burger. All Shaden started. If people continue to buy these franchises and not check out the web sights of all the scams of these evil people I can't help you. Yes I bought a 123 fit and lost my retirement in nine months. As franchises and former franchises we need to get an association of franchises and start a committee in Washington DC. March and yell at our government for new laws to make one sided contracts a thing of the pass. Like a wise lawyer told me zee's are weak because they whin and do nothing. I don't care if you are a Quiznos, 123 fit, Smashburger,Taco Del Mar, and zee who knows their getting screwed should join this cause. Go to Blue Mau Mau and ask questions and learn the mind of the zor. I have. Most are not good. The best thing is to fight and never give up. Things will not change until the voice of the people are heard. These liers will continue to hurt the good honest people. After all you have to have something going for you to even buy a franchise. We are just uninformed professionals and the franchizor are financial sociopaths. They belong in prison and I can't wait to see justice prevail. Remember they do not think like you. They have to be sick to hurt people like they do. Do Diligence

Mike
Mike

If anybody knows how to get my franchise fee back, please contact me at mhuie2000@yahoo.com

FMY
FMY

Hi, I was thinking of opening Quiznos outlet and was very surprised to hear all these negative comments and news. I would like to know whether are there any franchisees here who are operating outside America. Would be very glad to hear your experiences and get any advices if I could. Thank you. Please do email me at fadhalina@hotmail.com.

Starting to see the light
Starting to see the light

I was presented with what sounded like an outstanding offer to buy a fairly new Quiznos at a great price (1/5 the cost of a new build out). The books looked good but more profit could be made if labor and food cost were better managed.Could this store be profitable or am I making a mistake? Thanks

fred
fred

the stores are closing in my area. its a shame the fat cats at the top that scammed many people out of money and years of life/hopes will not be punished as they should be. quiznos is the enron of fast food.

Another Toasted Franchizee
Another Toasted Franchizee

Whatever you do, absolutely positivly do not sign up with Quiznos This company is a scam, my sister is in New york and we both signed up at the same time. I thought she was lucky because she located a site fast while I was still looking. Turns out I was the lucky one. She now gets to work 80 hour weeks making less than minimum wage with zero return on the investment. They opened aproximately 30 stores in her area in New York within an 18 month period. Two years later, there were less than 10 remaining open. All the nes who closed lost anywhere from $200K to $400K in less than two years. Of the ones remaining open, most are at about break even (so essentially their work is free). Few are making a little... I mean very little! Well I was lucky and only lost $25K plus maybe another $5K in other expenses and a lot of time looking for locations. I feel fortunate that this is all I lost because the unlucky ones who actually opened a store mostly lost a lot more. I am not taking it lying down. i am initiating a lawsuit even if the cost will be equal to what I recover. A lawsuit will result in legal recording and a warning to others (hopfully they do more due diligence before they believe the lies of the quiznos reps). Also, keep in mind that the crooks in Colorado have an "exit strategy" and will try to sell the franchize enterprise or get aquired. By initiating the lawsuits, you will be blocking their exit strategy, or severly limit what they can get for it. Who whould pay a premium price for a frianchizor who is severly hated by all the franchizees? Lucky in California

Quiznos "Bad Idea for Franchisees"
Quiznos "Bad Idea for Franchisees"

[quote comment="5997"][quote comment="5661"]DON'T DO IT....THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT ETHICAL AT ALL....I HAVE $250,000 REASONS TO BELIEVE THAT[/quote] i don't like drive-by postings...how about some details so your comments can help other?[/quote] How about this for details: I purchased the rights for 4 Franchises in UT. . I was able to open 3 however I would have rather just write them a check for $500k and left it at that. I LOST it all. . I am joing the law suit. (My accountant after I was able to use my own and found a good one says. . it is impossible to make $ on these your food cost is too high. . He knows what he is talking about he owns 2 other food franchises himself, His comment "Quiznos is just out for themselves. . Sell NOW, it will only get worse". . . The only ones that have a chance to make any $ on these are the ones that have the stores almost given to them. . then they still regret selling their souls the Quiznos. I have heard that the new CEO is promising but I was too far under by the time he took over. . . Quiznos corp has agressively squashed any free speach from websites "disparaging them" ie: TSFA (who is a trying to represent the Franchisee). . My suggestion is DO NOT OPEN a Quiznos. .It will just perpetuate their image. . YOU WILL CONTROL NOTHING you give them $25k for the right to pay them 11% of everything you earn or DON'T EARN. .with NO CONTROL over your own business. . better just go work for McDonalds. . at least at the end of the Week you get a pay check and possibly some benifits. You have ALL THE RISK the Franchisor has NONE but they have all the control. A LITTLE ONE SIDED (Sarcasm implied) Believe it or not it is comforting to know that I was not the root cause of the failure. . now lets see if I can get my life back on track. . .Thank God for a supportive wife Good Luck in your decision making

anonymous
anonymous

When a store closes there is enough blame to go around including the franchisor. Everyone agrees that no one suffers more than the franchisee that made all the investment in time and money. But you can't always blame the franchisor. Did you do your due diligence with your lawyer with regards to the franchise argreement? Did you contact other franchisees about their expeiences? Did you go to websites such as this one for more info? If you didn't then take your lumps and move on. If you did and still feel misled, then also blame your lawyer, other franchisees and yourself along with the franchisor. In my experiences I agree that not all franchisors care about the well being of the franchisee as much as they should, but franchisees are not blameless. I have seen franchisees trying to sell their store give false P&Ls, over report sales to mislead potential buyers, offer franchisor reps cash to help the deal go thru, and outright lie to buyers. The same morally wrong things that franchisors are being accused of. For those of you with still open stores that you can't sell that are money pits - why don't you close? If its inevitable, then do it it now and stop sinking good money after bad. I know its a huge emotional step to close your store, but its the right financial one. I don't mean to sound cold, but again when a store suffers its rare that the reasons are all 1 sided.

Michael Corona
Michael Corona

I know how you can get out of it. A bullet to the head.

quiz NO
quiz NO

Hi, So sorry to hear everyone's quizno problems. ANY advice at all on how to close a store? I've heard horror stories of Q corporate suing owners who walk away from their stores. Are they true? An owner I know has become permanently disabled and can no longer physically or mentally run his store. According to the agreement he must sell this store within 120 days, less the transfer fee. As you all know, THERE ARE NO BUYERS, and there is no one to run the store. This store is not profitable. How can this owner get out ASAP?

anonymous123
anonymous123

could somebody help!!! store sold to buyer and buyer not certified over one year.i am certified managing owner with 25% share only on paper.new buyer defaulted , franchise agreement terminated. quiznos suing me for lost royalties for term of 15 years. any advice? please help.Any laws to protect against this suit.

Q'ed
Q'ed

The Quiznos business is designed to suck the life out of franchisees and churn, churn, churn, until new suckers can be found. Q keeps the negotiated savings on food, paper, and supplies. By Q's own numbers food costs were at 30% before the latest price hikes that included a buck a pound on Swiss and 40 cents a pound on roast beef. There's no food co-op, no advertising co-op, killer giveaway coupons, and no transparency on how franchisee money is spent. Q doesn't even keep the revenue from the 7% franchise fee. That's been turned over to an investment bank as a return on its 49% investment in the company. That means Q only cares about how much food, ect franchisees buy, not what they sell. Don't think that matters? Franchisees subsidize giveaway coupons for subs, soup, drinks, and chips. They make nothing. Finally, there is no territorial integrity to limit stores in a certain area. The reason? Q makes more with two stores hanging on at $6,000 a week than with one store doing $10,000 a week. Quiznos is scum. May Rick and Dick Schaden rot in hell.

allen
allen

wild over wings is a small two unit franchise that only cares about themselves. I have had to put money in my unit every month for three years and have not made any money . I was the first frachisee and now I have been termintated for trademark infringement. They never invested a penny in my unit but now that want to take it. They are scam artists.

Fucking Quiznos
Fucking Quiznos

It has been night mare for us to have this crappy business. It is the worst night mare of my life. Do you know any buyer in Denver area?

Ripped off in Brownsburg
Ripped off in Brownsburg

We purchased a Quiznos franchise in 2004. We were told our restaurant would be open in approx. six months. We were never able to open the restaurant. The project manager told us we would receive a business plan cd to assist us in securing our long term financing. Quiznos never furnished the cd, without it we were unable to secure long term financing. We made an intial investment of $25,000 plus $1,450 lease review. When we told the project manager we couldn't go forward without the business plan cd, he told us we weren't getting our money back. That is the last we heard from them. Question: Is there anyone that has any success recovering their investment?

Indianapolis
Indianapolis

Ah, so THATS why its going for $39K!(The one I was looking at) Check it out: www.franchisebusinessforsale.com/franchises/index.html Quizno’s Subs #b-3326 For Sale Price - $39000; Business Location - Indianapolis North Side, Indiana This Is A Strong National Franchise With 4,000 Locations. Gross is $233321. Interestingly, no profit is listed. The worst part seems to be that they can open another one real close to you without you having any recourse. I asked the broker how long it had been on the market..5 months.."just reduced" in price. In closing I will add this: As of today, Oct.17th 2007 there are 354 Quiznos for sale on bizbuysell.com and 6 of those are under $40K. Four out of those 6 are listed as "undisclosed" as to their profitability. While there may be a handful of these restaurants that do stellar business, I think after much Internet research that these are the exception and not the rule, and i will look elsewhere for a franchise.

Q Zee
Q Zee

[quote comment="48509"]thank you for the information. you guys all saved me at least $25k[/quote] More than that, with real estate and construction costs it'd cost you $300k+. Food franchises is a headache of business with employee management (theft, attendance, tardiness, attitude, etc.) and expensive insurance and frequent litigation (slip & fall).

Richie Rich
Richie Rich

thank you for the information. you guys all saved me at least $25k

Houston, We have a Problem...
Houston, We have a Problem...

Houston, your problem with Quizno's is the same in very corner of America. . . .. in fact Quizno's is getting famous all over the world for their expertise in racketeering..... even in Canada the franchise Association has withstood years of harrassment and threats form their legal bandits but is close to getting their class action suit to court.......heard that in Windsor Ontario this week ALL the Quizno's stores closed at the same time......... and look at the mess they left behind in Australia when they shut down all operations...leaving another continent in disarray..... what a track record.....what a company....! Maybe all the stores that are close to closing or hanging on by a thread should band together and ALL close together, all over the world - on the same date! That would mess up their legal experts for some time, or at least it would make a strong statement and get noticed on Wall Street. Let JP Morgan explain that to potential shareholders..........hit them where it hurts them!

HoustonOwner
HoustonOwner

I bought two quiznos franchise agreements about 2 years ago and I am interested in selling both of them for half the price. I am interested in finding people that were in similar situations in the past and how were able to get rid of their franchise agreements. Someone told me that I need transfer addendum. Is this true? Any help will be appreciated.

Joel Libava
Joel Libava

It is amazing that those folks that invested in Quizno's as a franchise opportunity recently, didn't hear about all the stuff that was really going on behind the scenes, This is a prime example of not learning about the proper research techniques to get the facts, before one invests! Joel Libava/Cleveland, Ohio franchise expert/consultant

A friend in the U.S.
A friend in the U.S.

[quote comment="3284"]How about the new CEO. The broker selling the existing unit I was thinking of buying is sending me press on this guy. Anyone know of any good things he is doing? I am being told he has reduced supplier costs by 15-20% and has plans to lessen the menu to 22 sandwiches. Also work more with store owners. I don't know if I can believe any of this. the franchise I was thinking of buying is practically being given away, literally. Too good to be true?[/quote] A family member is about to lose in excess of 1/4 million after only three weeks of opening. He has basically been scammed and I was about to follow him. The model used by Quiznos does not work--period. I don't even know how any store is still open. I think some owners went in with so much money upfront that they have managed to stay open for a while or found an incredibly good site and are turning a profit. However, the odds of finding a site that brings in at LEAST $15K is like a lottery ticket--and if you think about it--if you come in with $300K--well at 6% in the bank that would give yo about $20K in return WITHOUT LIFTING A FINGER AND NO RISK. Some owners, the successful ones, are just breaking even and breaking their backs 24/7. The part time help is in better financial status at almost any Quiznos.

SCREW_THE_Q
SCREW_THE_Q

STAY AWAY FROM Q - LEARN FROM LESSONS LEARNED FROM ALL PEOPLE WHO'VE OPENLY SPOKEN IN THIS FORUM - Q IS A MAJOR SCREW-UP IF YOU LET IT HAPPEN TO YOU - DON'T BUY Q FOR A PENNY OR EVEN FREE AS YOUR LIFE WILL BE MESSED UP FEEDING THIS GODZILLA ALIEN THAT FEEDS MILLION DOLLARS OUT OF YOUR POCKETS. I GOT SAVED JUST BY RESEARCHING AND READING FORUMS LIKE THIS ONE AND OTHERS NOTED BELOW.... http://www.small-business-forum.com/archive/index.php/t-4568.html http://www.toastedsubs.info/phpBB2/index.php http://franchisepundit.com/index.php/2005/04/10/what-a-quiznos-franchisee-makes/

SCREW_THE_Q
SCREW_THE_Q

SCREW THE Q. I WENT ALL THE WAY TO TOP TALKING TO THE SR EXECS. GOT NO GOOD ANSWER RATHER A 400+ PAGES OF AGREEMENT PAPERWORK THAT WILL WASH YOUR BLOOD THINNER THAN VAPORWARE. I STRONGLY SUGGEST NEVER DEAL WITH THEM. STAY AT HOME, WORK SOMEWHERE, BUT DON"T FALL INTO FRANCHISE (NEW OR EXISTING) TACTICS. YOU WILL BEARLY BREAK-EVEN AFTER SPENDING 7-DAYS A WEEK IN THE STORE AND GETTING ALL YOUR MONEY SQUEEZED OUT IN THE SUPPLIERS RACKETEER BY Q. IT IS A BAIT AND YOU WILL LOSE. YOU ARE BETTER OFF IN SLOT MACHINES RATHER LOSING YOUR SHIRT

Bottom Fisher
Bottom Fisher

In doing some searches to get more info on Quiznos franchises I came upon an auctioneer's website. These guys are in the Chicago area. They list their past auctions. In the last two years or so they have liquidated 13 Quiznos stores. To me, that means that 13 owners were unable to stay open AND they were unable to sell their stores for more than liquidation value which I would guess is pretty low. I'm still interested in following up on the idea of locating a distressed store, but the amount I would be willing to pay for it goes down the more I learn. If anyone has any info which they believe would help me, please be so kind as to post it. Thank you.

owner in texas
owner in texas

[quote comment="28783"]Duper.... Cut your losses at $25k. I left a good paying job because I was a moron also. I should have let the have the $25k with a big middle finger and kept my coporate job. Unless you're from the Middle East or Asia and enjoy working 7 days a week, stay away. If you want to work 7 days a week, I suggest opening a donut shop....at least you close at noon or 1pm. I found a lower paying job than I had before with a worse health plan and 401K...but at least I don't own a Quiznos. The sales reps are a joke..... F U C K the Q

owner in texas
owner in texas

Duper.... Cut your losses at $25k. I left a good paying job because I was a moron also. I should have let the have the $25k with a big middle finger and kept my coporate job. If your not from the Middle East or Asia and enjoy working 7 days a week, I suggest opening a donut shop....at least you close at noon or 1pm. I found a lower paying job than I had before with a worse health plan and 401K...but at least I don't own a Quiznos. The sales reps are a joke..... F U C K the Q

Bottom Fisher
Bottom Fisher

Does anyone have any recent statistics as to how many stores have been shut down by their owners? Any statistics on the percentage of stores which are currently unprofitable? Any info on how much marginal or unprofitable stores have sold for in the past?

mr.duper
mr.duper

I was lied to by a former salesman,J.J.Moran. He told me in front of my wife -"...three locations are within three miles of your residence." Well once the bastards had my money-all locations offered were 30 minutes travel time from our residence. I turned down four stores. Not one of the 'reps' called me for months.Finally after numerous calls to the director of sales in my state I was told to find my own store. I found a five great possible stores.One was 800 sq.ft. larger then was required which was found suitable by me & the rest of the Quiznos morans. Finally I had a contract to sign for the store. The problem was they wanted to tell me I could only use the extra space for dry goods. So I'm out of my franchise fee of $25,000 but I may just fly out to corporate headquarters with my two friends,'Smith & Wesson' ...if only I was that crazy.

Hook, Line and sinker
Hook, Line and sinker

Anonymous.. can you give me some details on what Quizno's did when they shut down your stores, as I may be in the same boat soon. Regards

Bottom Fisher
Bottom Fisher

What problems did you have with them while shutting your store down?

Perry
Perry

No. I own a small landscaping business. Best of luck with your litigation strategy. Cheers.

File a complaint w/the F.T.C.
File a complaint w/the F.T.C.

Perry, I am glad you brought that up. I think that all would agree, when you purchase a bank check or withdraw from your account it is at that time that you have decided to commit to follow through with a purchase or transaction. I do not know of anyone that would withdraw $25,000 of interest bearing revenue only to hold on to it to give to someone at a later date. This 10+ day waiting period is put in place to protect the consumer from making a hasty decision. A transaction, especially of this magnitude, considering the sales pitch, etc. needs some time to be thought through and the Federal Trades Commission mandates this waiting period just for that reason. For the sake of argument; your idea of purchasing a check and giving it at a later date, still only shows that the decision was made within the 10 day waiting period. The legal staff from Quiznos knows this and that is why they dissolved the contract, cashed the check and issued a refund check. I have a better question. Why is it that these transactions do not have to be notarized? Then both parties are protected. Whether mandated or not, I think that if Quiznos really wanted to prevent things like this from happening that these transactions would be notarized. F.Y.I. a sales person in the state of Massachusetts can not notarize a transaction due to the fact that they have something to gain from the transaction. Therefore leaving me with a fair and legitamate claim with the F.T.C. against the Quiznos corp. By the way Perry, do you work for Quiznos?

Perry
Perry

I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think having a copy of a pre-dated bank check proves anything. For instance, I could get a cashiers check from the bank today for $25,000 and give it to somebody a month from now. The transaction would occur on the date I handed over the check, not the date it was issued to me. Good luck and post how your FTC strartegy proceeds.

File a complaint w/the F.T.C.
File a complaint w/the F.T.C.

I could not agree more with the previous comments. I am also considering myself lucky to have escaped with $25,000 on the line, unlike many of the previous postings. I am currently seeking a refund of my franchise fee from Quiznos and in the mean time have filed a complaint with the F.T.C. The Federal Trades Commission mandates a 10 business day waiting period from the date that the potential franchise owner is given a copy of the U.F.C. before a franchise agreement can be signed. We first signed an agreement in October of 2006. The sales rep. gave us some explanation for dating all the papers with the next day's date. He had overlooked one thing. We paid with a bank check dated with the correct date. This explains why a personal check was preferred over a bank check. Had we paid with a personal check, we would have been advised to predate the check and no one would have been the wiser. After reviewing our paperwork, the Quizno's legal staff returned our check and we had to begin the process all over again. Unfortunately that should have been enough to send us packing, but we went ahead in December of 2006 and signed the agreement again. The sales rep. acted as though this was an inconvenience for us and to avoid it from happening again, he counted backwards the 10+ business days and used this date for us to sign the paperwork stating that we received the U.F.C. from Quiznos on that date. We then went ahead, most ignorant on our behalf, and once again signed the franchise agreement, this time leaving no paper trail. I have proof that the Quiznos Sales team conducts business in this manner with a copy of our first signed agreement and a copy of the bank check dated prior to the mandated 10 day waiting period. Regardless of the fact that the Quiznos legal staff has dotted their i's and crossed their t's, I believe this was common practice among the Sales Representatives. I have filed a complaint with the F.T.C. and was told that a fine of $11,000 per infraction could be imposed should there be an investigation. The surprising fact is that with all the negative press, allegations and lawsuits, Quiznos has yet (according to the F.T.C. rep.) to be investigated by the Federal Trades Commission, let alone fined for unfair trades practice. If you believe that you were mislead into signing the agreement prior to the 10 day waiting, please contact the F.T.C. to file a complaint. I believe that my proof should be enough to sustain probability on the behalf of others in the same situation. If you have a complaint of any nature in regards to Quiznos conducting unfair business, please file a complaint. It may not get your money back but it could help to hold Quiznos some what accountable for their unfair and deceptive business practices. You can obtain information for filing a complaint on the F.T.C.'s website: www.ftc.gov Also, below is a link to the franchise page. http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/edu/pubs/consumer/invest/inv07.shtm Please pass this information on. Thank you.

Missouri quizno's complaint
Missouri quizno's complaint

Any info on filing a class action suit against Quizno's in Missouri? They took our $25,000 deposit and ran. No help on finding a location within 2 years. Any info on getting that money back?